SPEAKER_01 0:35

Welcome to Amplify Your Authority, the podcast where innovative marketing meets heart-centered entrepreneurship. Join Marissa Shadrick, an award-winning international speaker, Ray Edwards certified copywriter, and personal brand expert. You'll gain insights into the external strategies for business growth and how to navigate the internal journey of entrepreneurship. Now get ready to amplify your authority in a competitive digital world. And now is your host, Marissa Shadrick.

SPEAKER_03 1:01

Hello, everyone. How are you doing? I'm Marissa Shadrick, online marketing consultant and certified copywriter. And with me today is Kathy Farah, the one and only Convert Kid email strategist. Welcome, Kathy.

SPEAKER_04 1:15

Hello, hello. How are you?

SPEAKER_03 1:19

I'm doing pretty good, other than having like tech issues today.

SPEAKER_04 1:23

We're trying to say your patience was great.

SPEAKER_03 1:27

We're trying to record live on LinkedIn. And guess what? Like everything else, every tool, everything, once you learn it, they change it. Just like they change everything. Isn't that the way it is, even with our topic today about creating irresistible offers? We think we have everything figured out, and then the the whole game changes, right? And so we're starting over from scratch. But I'm so glad that you're here and listening. Today we have a really interesting uh topic, and it's it's a phrase that gets thrown around a lot. So I titled this episode that how to create free offers your audience can't refuse those so-called quote unquote irresistible offers. So we're gonna unpack that a little bit, and then we're also gonna do a critique today. We have a critique from Laura Magnum Broom, and her lead magnet is one that she uses when she's a podcast guest, and we're gonna take a look at that. So for listeners who are listen-only mode, you're gonna be able to hear us describe what the lead magnet is. But if you want to get a little closer view and you want to actually see what we see, you can always click the YouTube option. You'll be able to see the actual lead magnet and some of the comments that we're making on it. So, first of all, we're going to talk about those irresistible offers. So, Kathy, what what's your take on this as far as irresistible offer? I'm curious to hear, you know, what you have to say about this because we hear it thrown around a lot.

SPEAKER_04 3:00

Yes. And it seems a lot easier than done. I mean, I think, I think when you hear this, it's like, oh, sure, I know what I offer. So I'll just whip up something and, you know, I think this is what my audience wants. So this should be perfect. And all I'll do is create this freebie and everybody will run and and grab it. And then you start to realize that um you may have missed a few steps. You may have discovered things aren't working as planned. So I think this whole idea of no one offers exactly perfect. We have to do research. We have to dig a little deeper to figure out what's going to work and test, test, test to see if our assumptions are correct, even with what research we may do.

SPEAKER_03 3:51

Yeah, I think a problem that a lot of people, and I've fallen into this too, is that we don't give the free offers as much attention as we do the paid offers because they're free. And we figure, well, it's free. They're gonna download it, they're gonna give me their email address because it's free. So because it's free, we kind of gloss over, we kind of think that as long as we have a beautifully graphically designed PDF on Canva, that that's gonna be it, or maybe you even work on the copy and we've got some copy in there that helps, or maybe graphics that help, and we think, oh, this is perfect. This is going to allow me to get at least 50 subscribers a month, and I'll be able to grow my email list in about three, four months, and then launch my product. And then all of a sudden, crickets, they don't hear anything. So obviously that's telling us it's more than graphics, it's more than copy. It really has to deal with something that's not only going to capture their attention, but something that's gonna bring some type of fulfillment right away. Now, we've talked about reducing complexity and also you know being able to help people save time. Those are absolutely true. But when it comes to the initial part of a lead magnet, of a free offer, we have to really do the pre-work almost as much as we do when we're selling something. And so if we're taking a slice of what we sell and we're gonna offer that free, all that pre-work we did for that product we're gonna sell applies with the free resource as well. Wouldn't you say that's true, Kathy? There's a lot more behind the scenes.

SPEAKER_04 5:39

There is a lot more work because I think you know, the assumption is sometimes that free is enticing enough. And like you were just describing, with even with all the other bells and whistles, free isn't enough. And I think honestly, people are overwhelmed. So it really has to grab your attention. Is this something that's going to be helpful for me right now in that moment? Um, so I think that's something that as we're researching this and realizing that we can't just create even that, even if we do spend the right amount of time, that free offer, it's not a one and done. We may have to go and offer more things. And and I think get past a little bit of that mindset of thinking that I don't want to give away everything, like, oh, this is too good, but you really need it to be too good. Like you need it to really kind of show a little sample of what you do and and how you help transform your your ideal audience and your your clients, what they gain from it.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

I totally agree. It needs to be just as good when they look at it online. They they must look at it and think, oh, is this is this a paid offer? They must look at it in a way that it looks so professional, so polished, and to so to the point, right? Because like you said, I love what you said, free is not enough. You would think free is enough, but it's not. Free is not enough. People are very careful about giving their email address. Plus, your market changes. And some people think one lead magnet's enough, and they created something maybe three years ago, maybe their business has evolved even more, and they've created something, and then that's it. They just put all their all their efforts into that one lead magnet, and they should consider creating multiple lead magnets. And some people say, you know, consider creating a new lead magnet every year. I would say, depending on the outcome, maybe it's time to consider a new lead magnet and have a variety of ways to come into a building. You know how a building has many doors? Find ways to bring people in through a different door. Because I'll tell you, those big companies that have these lead magnets that convert, and there's all kinds of lead magnets. I mean, you talk about quizzes, PDFs, webinars, a lead magnet. There's a lot of lead magnets. But those companies, they do a lot of testing first. They test a copy, they interview clients, they try to figure out, you know, what it is that they need right now, today. Because look, since even 2020, all the changes we've gone through, right? What resonated three years ago may not resonate today.

SPEAKER_04 8:30

Right. Right. And I think it's almost even more overwhelming today. You know, I think so much has changed, and so many people are are really kind of out in the marketplace trying to offer free things to get people on their list because that is what we've always been told is create, you know, a free guide or free something PDF, and that's all you have to do. And that gets them in the door, and there you go. So I think everybody's kind of done have done that, and it it sort of has flooded the market. So now it's people are being a lot more choosy about what things they're gravitating to. It really has to tap into their what their needs are at that moment.

SPEAKER_03 9:16

Yeah. And it can't be clickbaitish either, just to get them to give you and because you just break trust. And the whole purpose is to build trust, not to create something that's clickbait that they download and all of a sudden they're disappointed because this thing is just a plain document that looks like it took them five minutes to do. Now, do I am I saying it has to be long? Am I saying it's supposed to be short? What I'm saying is it needs to align with your audience. Because I've seen even short little ebooks as lead magnets that do well because the audience enjoys that and will read that, but it's not for everyone. So what works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other. So the it's not really the length of it either. It just depends on saying enough. And I think Ray Edwards said this make your your copy as long as it needs to be to get the point across. So that goes again to the actual document itself, if it's a document. Like I said, there's other lead magnets too. Uh, maybe you have an automated webinar, you know, again, all the copy tips that we shared about making it benefit driven, you know, outcome-based, identifying the audience, all those things are important in the copy. But if you don't figure out what it is they want, you could do that all day long, it's not gonna land. And so I think it's being willing to do the work that nobody else will do, and that will help you stand out. And nobody wants to hear that. Right. But we want to be honest, don't we? Don't we that we want to be honest with you? There's no magic bullet. There's no magic bullet. But you can create an irresistible offer if you do the pre-work to figure out exactly what it is that they need.

SPEAKER_04 11:11

And think about just, I was gonna say, even think about how you are as a person and what you consume. You know, where I was a couple of years ago and the things that I was looking for at that time is very different than what I'm looking at and looking for today. And and that evolves just like with anyone else. So your audience is going to evolve, and what worked for them before may not work now, as we've already kind of talked about, but you can just think about just the way you consume content and what would have enticed you um a few months ago versus now, and what you're sort of looking for. You need to be asking your audience that same question. What, you know, what is really clicking, you know, looking in forums and things like that to try to find out where your audience hangs out and sort of what they seem to be frustrated by, you know, how can you help solve that problem for them?

SPEAKER_03 12:06

Right. And I think too, when people create a new lead magnet, you know, we're we're doing our due diligence, we're trying to figure out doing our homework, our pre-work to try to figure out what it is that they want. But then if it doesn't get the response we're hoping for, um, it's not a time to throw up our hands and go, oh well, I guess I'll start over and try to figure something else out. Let me see what my competitors are giving, or let me see what someone else is doing and do that. No, no. Most people, and and I'm gonna tell you the truth, because most people will adjust and tweak to see if it was the copy, and the copy could be the headline, and they tweak one thing. Maybe it's the headline and the outcome, maybe it's the graphic. Maybe the graphic looks too promotional. Yeah, you know, you don't know until you test. So by testing, you begin to dial it in, and then you you look back at analytics, and you're familiar with this, Kathy, because you look at a lot of analytics. Analytics tells us a lot, right? Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 13:17

Sure. Yeah, and and even like one of the things that I am thinking about is sometimes just changing the headline, you know, what grabs the attention, kind of framing it a little different. But you're right, looking at the analytics, seeing whether or not people are opening, engaging with it, um, what your click rates are, that type of thing makes a difference. Are you getting the numbers of people join your list that you anticipated? If you're not seeing those results, then you know something's not working and it's time to investigate and make some changes.

SPEAKER_03 13:51

Yeah. And here's why I think it's so important to focus on the lead magnet with great intention, is because the lead magnet is the beginning of the relationship and it's the beginning of the nurturing sequence, and those become warm prospects that will later potentially become buyers. We focus so much on the sales and the product and not give enough attention to the lead magnet when the lead magnet is what starts the whole ball rolling.

SPEAKER_04 14:24

So all of the things that we're gonna do is the first impression, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:27

Absolutely. And then the the placement of it, right? We want to use it and put it everywhere that we can to test it well. Cause and one of the things too, Kathy, that I've noticed because I ask people you know these questions and and I ask them if they have like a call to action, like after they do like an article or a newsletter or something on social. And a lot of times there isn't.

SPEAKER_04 14:54

Right. And I'm going to go missed opportunities. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:59

Why isn't there a call to action? Because if you're providing free, helpful content online, you can always that gives you permission. You have permission. Okay. You have permission to put a call to action. That's why you're doing it because you're in business. So you could put a call to action and offer them this great free resource. So everything becomes really around that topic of what you want to sell, the transformation you provide. You pull out a little piece, a slice of that, and then you talk about that in your post. So it makes a natural transition for the free resource. So there's a strategy behind it. You don't go off grid and start talking about other things where there's not alignment or reason to download your resource, right? So all of that plays in, you know. So to create an irresistible offer, can we? We can if we're willing to do the things that most people want. And that is, let's break it down for them. Where should they start, Kathy? Number one.

SPEAKER_04 16:02

Research. Yeah, research. Research. Talking to your audience, surveying your audience, talking to your clients, like what are people's pain points? What challenges are they experiencing? You know, what problems are you able to solve? If you're being able to talk to your audience or groups that you participate in to find out what they, you know, what's most needed right now? What's how can you eliminate um anxiety or worry or some, you know, ease struggles with the thing that you do kind of is the first place, like, okay, now you can kind of think about what you might offer to help fix that problem, resolve that issue.

SPEAKER_03 16:49

Exactly. Trying to find out what would make a difference for you right now in your business as far as your workflow or your lead acquisition or any of those things, asking them specifically what would make a difference, what would be the difference maker? What would you want given to you that would help your day-to-day right now? And then a lot of times what they say could be something that you can create for them. So definitely, and then you know, headlines are super important. I would suggest creating a lot of headlines first on a draft copy and looking to see which ones really pack a punch as far as the outcome, you know, being honest and has an outcome transformation and using that language, because you only have a little bit of space, right? So we want to make sure that we make the most out of that space and make it super clear, not clever, so that then when they see it, they can self-identify. So because we don't have a lot of time, do we, Kathy?

SPEAKER_04 17:57

No, and I think that I think let's touch on that point again that it's it's a mindset shift of clever, you know, isn't what you need. It's clear. It's so that someone can just very easily understand what you're offering and what's you know, what is it resolving? What problem is it resolving? I think our general thought is that we need to make it sound fun or you know interesting than just being direct about what it is that you're offering.

SPEAKER_02 18:29

And clear isn't always easy. Right. It is hard. I think it's far harder to write clear than it is to add a lot more adjectives.

SPEAKER_03 18:37

Yeah. The less words you have, the harder it is. Otherwise, you end up with things and this and that and that. So if you want this, this, and this, and this, then download this and you'll get this, this, and this, and this. That's because you you're missing a word that's really going to explain what this is if you got to add too many of those adjectives, yeah, for sure. But that's a good place to start. And then once you do the research, then you you test, right? Number two is you test.

SPEAKER_04 19:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:07

And you put it out there, and I would suggest test it organically for like 30 days. Right. Yes. And then where should they go to see how it's performing, Kathy?

SPEAKER_04 19:19

They look at their analytics and you see how what's happening. Are people coming and checking it out? Like, you know. So then you could test just one or two elements, make a change. Like, if the analytics are not looking the way you would anticipate, then you could change one element and see if that changes something. So that's kind of that idea of the A-B testing where it's test this and then try this, you know, and see how those pieces work instead of changing everything.

SPEAKER_03 19:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:50

Which is our tendency, like it's toss it out, let's just start over. Sometimes those little small tweaks may be exactly what clicks for someone else.

SPEAKER_03 20:00

And if you have no idea whatsoever where to start, um, again, not every lead magnet is for everyone. There's different types. There's quizzes, PDFs, there's um ebooks I've seen, there's all kinds, there's templates. For a while, their templates are really popular. I don't know anymore with AI if they are as much. I don't know. I'd have to look that up. But if you don't know where to start, just those integrating those one question surveys, one question throughout your memberships, your email community, your social community, having it as a standard of once in a while just asking questions to get that feedback to figure out if you're really hitting the target is very helpful because the market does change and people evolve. And so that's always helpful to have that as an ongoing thing that goes on. And um, you could even do something like that and automate it in your email marketing, which Kathy's good at that. So get a sequence going, right? Where periodically they can send a survey, a one question, keep it simple. Right, right. So yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:15

Think uh yeah, the power of one, right? You know, so just something that's very easy for you to kind of get a little more feedback as you go throughout the process in your your welcome sequence.

SPEAKER_03 21:25

Yeah, yeah. We spend a little extra time on this because it's just one of those topics that I just I feel bad for people because they make it sound like it's it's just so easy. Just create a simple thing, you know, and do it in a weekend and you're done without doing all the pre-work, without reviewing all the analytics, without really seeing if that's what the audience wants. Because if you do everything and you check all the boxes and they don't want that, then why would they buy the product? So you know, and hopefully you've done all this to figure out what products you want to offer your audience to.

SPEAKER_04 22:07

And I think a lot of times what we do sometimes as small business owners is that we listen to the experts for guidance of should we do a quiz, should we do a masterclass, should we do PDF? We we look to the experts or we start analyzing what all these other companies might be doing instead of really what our audience, what they are needing and desiring, and and actually tackling. Into the people that we're working with, and our email list and that type of thing is really a much more productive use of your time than being overwhelmed of checking everything on Instagram and LinkedIn or wherever to see what the experts are doing in their market because their audience may respond differently to whatever their free guide or free be is for their email list.

SPEAKER_03 23:02

Yes, for sure. And then if you have an offer that's an intangible, like if it's something to do with mindset, it applies even more so. You have to be so clear so they understand what this transformation is, and so they download that freebie and so they'll be willing to invest in the product that you have. So understanding the right audience too is important, which kind of segues into our lead magnet that we're going to critique. Um, she's done an amazing job, so I don't think we'll spend too much time on it, but she has an intangible, right? So this is a great example of that. It's uh I cope to hope. Um, and this particular lead magnet that Laura Magnum Mangan Broom has given us to review um is one that she gives to podcast host when she's a guest. And so this is for their audiences. So I'm gonna share my screen real quick, and so we'll try to talk through for those listening to the audio what we see. So let me share my screen here. All right, Kathy, can you see that?

SPEAKER_04 24:20

Not yet. Do I can make it a little bigger? I can't now. Just a little bit, please.

SPEAKER_03 24:26

Okay. Thank you. There we go. She's got her she's got two square boxes side by side with a logo on top that says I cope to hope. And there's a background, and you barely see the background. It looks almost like an office setting background or a cup of coffee, a desk of some sort in the background. So there's an image background overlay, and then two boxes. The left box is blue, the right box is white, and the left box has images, and the right box just has feels for an email address. So, Kathy, do you want to read what it says in those boxes starting from left to right?

SPEAKER_04 25:06

Sure. Um, in the left side box, it's 20 key strategies to strengthen resilience and embrace change.

SPEAKER_03 25:16

Lovely.

SPEAKER_04 25:16

And then on the right side, it implement these strategies today and begin a new chapter of your life. And then it's enter your first name, email address, and get checklist.

SPEAKER_03 25:28

Yeah. So the one box is really just for feels, the one on the right, and the left one is the creative. So the image is that of a of a PDF document, and you kind of see like an iPad view and then pages behind it. So we see that there's multiple pages in this PDF and the headline 20 key strategies to strengthen resilience and embrace change for those people. Now we're looking at at the psychographic, right? More than a demographic. Because we're not talking about business owners, we're not talking about men, we're not talking about women, we're not talking about um, you know, stay-at-home moms, we're not, we're not talking about any of that. We're talking about those people that need to embrace change and need resilience. So it's more of that psychographic. 20 key strategies to strengthen resilience to embrace change, because change is difficult. So, what do you think of that headline?

SPEAKER_04 26:30

I like it. I think that it's it gives you an idea of what you're gonna get and what it's it's trying to do. I mean, to have the strategies to be able to strengthen your resilience and embrace change. Change is something that's hard to do. So to have some strategies on helping you to go through you know major changes or be able to strengthen your resilience as you start to change, I think is a helpful topic for really anybody going through life transitions.

SPEAKER_03 27:07

Yeah, for sure, because a lot of people go through lots of changes, and change is the most difficult thing to go through, especially when we don't initiate it, right? Right, right. I know. So on the right side, right above the fields, to put your name and email, it says the implement these strategies today, creating a little bit of urgency, create implement these today and begin. So this is the trade, implement them today so you can get this result. And the result is and begin a new chapter of your life. So I love how she phrased that because we can all look back at moments in our lives where things shifted and it was a new chapter. For example, uh, people that went to college and graduated, a new chapter begins. People that get married, right? And all of a sudden start a family, a new chapter begins. People maybe in um retirement, right? A new chapter begins. People start a career, maybe they start their own business, a new chapter begins. So we can think of those times of a new chapter and how significant they were because it was a shift, but it's not easy. Right. So I I think with the amount of words that she used here, I think she did a really great job.

SPEAKER_04 28:27

Yeah, I think she's made it clear. It's not overly clever, right? It's intentionally clear and helps you because just like what you just did, that's what you start to think to yourself is those moments of where something changes. And I think all of us can kind of relate to those moments. Like for myself, I'm currently going through changes. So it's it's like these things that are happening. I think that's relatable to the audience as they're going through that experience. And that's what you're going to start to draw to. It it allows you to believe it really would apply to anybody, you know, experiencing change in their life.

SPEAKER_03 29:09

And she didn't waste any of the space too, because even the button gives us a little bit more insight to what this document is because the button says get checklist.

SPEAKER_02 29:19

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 29:20

So we understand, and she didn't have to put that in the copy, she just put it in the button.

unknown 29:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:25

Get checklist.

SPEAKER_04 29:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:28

So I know there's brevity. It's clear and there's going to be brevity. There's going to be 20, 20 things on this checklist for me to be able to become more resilient and embrace change, whether it's it was initiated by me or not. And it's going to help me if I implement them today. That's my part, right? To really embrace and begin a new chapter of my life. And maybe, maybe it's health, maybe it's fitness. It could be a lot of different things. So I really I like the fact that it's so simple and clear. I really love that.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 30:06

Now she's got more, but wait, there's more. I love it. As we scroll down, she elaborates on this now.

SPEAKER_02 30:16

Okay, yes.

SPEAKER_03 30:18

Now, but the time above the fold said a lot, didn't it? Yes. Above the fold said a lot. But if you need a little more, you scroll down, and then she's got a headline or a subhead that says life is full of unexpected twists and turns. Now she's addressing the pain, right? The problem. Yes. And then she begins to let me uh make this a little bigger because the font is a little smaller. Yeah, there we go. There you go. So I mean, I'm loving this. I think the only feedback so far is make the font a little bigger. Yes. So here, you want to read this? Sure.

SPEAKER_04 31:00

Yeah. And I I want to one other comment too. This kind of addresses both type, you know, your audience's differences. In some people are just straight to the point. Let me, you know, you gave me what I needed at the very beginning. Boom, I want to sign up. I don't need any additional information. And now this is for the people that want to learn a little bit more before they're going to make a decision.

SPEAKER_03 31:21

Great point. Love that.

SPEAKER_04 31:23

So to start with what she's got, navigating these challenges requires resilience and a positive mindset. The the 20 key strategies to strengthen resilience and embrace change checklist provides practical and uplifting tips to help you face difficulties with grace and strength. These strategies are the ones I use to overcome bilateral breast cancer, losing my oldest child from suicide, a heart transplant, and a sudden divorce one month later. Like right there is a pretty powerful statement of all the change that she has the background. I just had to say that.

SPEAKER_03 32:05

Credibility, right? And that was right under that. I mean, we didn't read too far. We just went right in and she brought that credibility up there. So now we're going, okay, I want to listen more with this thing.

SPEAKER_04 32:17

Exactly. So I encourage you to focus on what you can control, find joy in everyday moments, and build a supportive network. Here's a summary of the key benefits of this invaluable checklist.

SPEAKER_03 32:31

Okay. Can we stop right there? Because right before we go to the bullets, I love that she gave them value already in this opt-in page, because she said, not only she goes, I encourage you to focus on what you can control. She's already giving them some insight. Yes. Find joy in everyday moments and build a supportive network. She just gave them three tips to begin to right out of the gate. So she's already building reciprocity. So I'm I'm giving you the jargon so you understand what it is. The credibility. Now there's reciprocity. She's giving them something there. And now she's going to explain the benefits of the checklist in bullet form. This is all white background and text. So nothing fancy. White background and text. Okay, Kathy.

SPEAKER_04 33:23

And so this also, which this goes right into what you love with the bullet point. So she's got in bold avoid thinking traps and focus on facts. And then it changes the font to just regular font, not bold. Instead of getting lost in what if scenarios, this strategy helps you stay grounded by focusing on the facts at hand, conserve conserving your mental energy for productive actions. The next bold line, next bullet is gratitude and humor as stress relievers. So she then changes the font, kind of goes back to where now it's practicing gratitude daily and finding humor in life can significantly reduce stress, making it easier to navigate challenges with a clear and positive mind. So there's another tip. On to the next part of the text, identifying your core values and setting boundaries around toxic influences helps protect your mental health and fosters a more positive and supportive environment. And then the final bullet in bold is encouraging proactivity and creativity. So back to regular text. By being proactive and thinking outside the box, you can develop a creative, develop creative solutions to overcome obstacles, enhancing your problem-solving skills, and boosting your confidence. So outside of the bullets, now the final statement says resilience is not about avoiding difficulties, but about learning to thrive despite them. Embrace these strategies and you'll find yourself better equipped to handle whatever comes your way. You've got this.

SPEAKER_03 35:28

Wow. That is beautifully done.

SPEAKER_04 35:31

She's got an excellent job. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:34

She's got five bullets. So if you just read the bold, it said avoid thinking traps and focus on facts. Second is gratitude and humor as stress relievers. Third, empowerment through control, fourth, setting healthy boundaries, and five, encouraging proactivity, and creativity. So uh beautifully done. Uh she just expanded on the idea that she had up above the fold, and she expanded and gave you more. She even gave you tips, she added credibility and she added reciprocity, and she made it in a way that was clean, a lot of white space, and in bullet form.

SPEAKER_04 36:16

Yes. She gets a little bit more. This is very click. Yeah, she does. I think this is all very well done. She's done a great job here. And I know she's been working hard on this.

SPEAKER_03 36:30

So she has been working hard on this and she's really nailed it. And this is an intangible. Right. This is an intangible. So you see how she was able to craft her copy in a way that really showed benefit and value, even though this is an intangible. You can't grab it, you can't touch it, you can't, you know, it's an intangible that, you know, and you help people, you know, increase their ROI or you help people, it's something that they see, right? But for an intangible, um, she did a fabulous job and she said enough at the above the fold so that people were saying, okay, yeah, that's what I need. They'll put their info in there. And as Kathy said, if they need a little more, right when she begins to tell her stories that this these strategies are the ones I used, and she starts talking about breast cancer, losing her oldest son to suicide, a heart transplant, and a sudden divorce. It's like, you got my attention.

SPEAKER_02 37:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:29

So um, well done. And she didn't do it in a bio form, she just weaved it into the copy without a chance.

SPEAKER_04 37:37

Until she's using this for herself, you know, she uses these strategies for herself. So she's a you know, a living example of the fact that these things work to be able to get through all of those major changes that were totally out of her control.

SPEAKER_03 37:55

Yeah. And in this particular one, since she's using this for podcast guesting, um, you know, it's it's good the way it is right now.

SPEAKER_02 38:04

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 38:05

Um, if it was something else, like if she had this like on a social media post or something, you you might want to have uh just a little bit about her at the bottom, you know, if you wanted to have it, but they're already interviewing her, they're they're talking to her, they're finding out about her. It's not really needed to, you know, do that again. So again, the environment, you know, what precedes it, and what you're trying to do is get them to go ahead and put in their name and email. And she's given even a little bit more, plus, she's given some tips, and it's well done. It's really well done. So I love this example because it's an intangible, and those are sometimes hard to put words around an intangible benefit. And she did a beautiful job. But I know she's worked on this really, really hard to try to.

SPEAKER_04 38:52

And it shows you the amount of effort, you know, we both know her. We know the amount of effort that it's taken and the length of time it's taken for her to create this free offer. So it kind of supports what you said at the opening of the fact of it you want to spend an adequate amount of time for even free offers to really grab attention because this is the reason why. This is the type of outcome that you gain by putting in that effort and really dialing in your message and what you're trying to say in such a beautiful way. And she, and and with intangibles, a lot of times this is where you find it's a little tricky that you end up having a lot of just adjectives just kind of crammed in there. And instead, I think she's made it very straightforward and clear, um, limiting that use to where you see the true value. You know, if you need that extra information, you get all these little bonuses along the way.

SPEAKER_03 39:52

Yeah. So, Kathy, I'm curious if someone's listening and saying, Oh, I need to create something new, maybe I should ask my email list. Do you help them with those kind of things? Do you help them with little surveys or do you help them craft what they need to craft to maybe test a new lead magnet? I'm just curious as how far your services go.

SPEAKER_04 40:14

Yes. So I do work with people that uh helping them build their welcome sequences or nurture sequences that are coming from their lead magnet. So a lot of times I work with clients to strategize and make sure that the message continues through as they nurture their relationship after somebody has signed up. So if they've put all the effort into the a great opt-in like this, then I would work with somebody to be able to make sure it keeps going back to that point that it's where they're heading them to the end offer that they're gaining, the paid offer. Um, that's part of what I work with them on to strategize those.

SPEAKER_03 40:55

In order to stay true, in order to stay true to what we advised, let's give a nice clean call to action to contact you, Kathy, if they need that, right? That'll be our call to action today, right? Yes. How can they contact you?

SPEAKER_04 41:09

You can um you can reach me um on LinkedIn at Kathy Farah. Um that's uh Farah F A R A H. Or you can reach out to me at email with Kathy at Kathyfara.com.

SPEAKER_03 41:24

Beautiful, beautiful. And thank you to Laura Manganbroom for giving us an opportunity to look take a look at her beautiful lead magnet, well done on an intangible transformation. She didn't waste any words, she didn't repeat any words, she said exactly what needed to be said above the fold, and it was to the point. And she she implemented a lot of copywriting principles within this lead magnet. So uh very well done. And uh if you need a podcast guest, you should reach out to Laura. Yeah, she's on LinkedIn, I know that too. So I will put I will put her contact information in the show notes so that you can reach out to her and hear her story because she has an amazing story, as you can see just from the little bit that she shared there on that lead magnet. So if you need someone that will motivate and inspire your audience, Laura is your gal. So uh I would encourage you to do that too. So that was okay, I cheated. That was two call to actions. What can I say? So you're supposed to only have one. That was the power of one out the window. That was just a recommendation endorsement. No, so so anyway, thank you, Kathy, so much for being with me today. It was a tough topic because I don't want to discourage people, but I want to I want them to know that it's not them. I want them to know that it's a process. There's yes, and there's no such thing as just do it, done, and watch them sign up. You know, we've there's a lot that precedes it, a lot that we do to tweak and create multiple lead magnets. And you may be already doing that, not realizing it, because you may be creating workshops and master classes and things like that. So each one is an opportunity to grow your email list, which is your most important asset. Any last words, Kathy, before we say goodbye?

SPEAKER_04 43:16

No, thank you. I appreciate the time. I always love these.

SPEAKER_03 43:20

I know they're fun, aren't they? Alrighty, everyone. Well, thanks so much. And uh, I'll try to get all my LinkedIn game all figured out, and we will stream the new recordings on LinkedIn as soon as we can. And in the meantime, you can always look forward to the replay with all the show notes. Until next time, thank you so much. Take care. Bye bye.